WE HAVE MOVED!!!

Visit our new, improved website at www.beyondorange.org

ARTICLE IN SLOVENIAN JANA MAGAZINE:

Original

ARTICLE IN SLOVENIAN PRIMORSKE NOVICE MAGAZINE:

English, Hungarian

ARTICLE IN AUSTRIAN PROFIL MAGAZINE:

German, English, Hungarian, Czech, Serbian, Slovenian

CALL TO ALL OFFICIALS OF THE ORGANIZATION

English, Croatian, Czech, Hungarian, Slovenian, German, Serbian

sex abuse scandal.
  • Roman March 2011
    Posts: 347
    I used to be swami for swAmi from 1993 to 2001 in the US. My name was S. Rameshwarananda. Now it is Roman Peterka. Alltogether I was his disciple for about 15 years. I left because I had hard time with things I saw and was part of for many years. I did not have any particular knowlege about these sexual abuse incidents first hand but heard some rumors. They partially contributed to my decision to leave but it was not the main reason. As I said, I did not have any hard evidence at the time. This forum is to serve as catalyzer to help the truth to come out. Every posting will stay as it was written regadless which side it is on. I will publish both sides of discussion uncensored. People should have open discussion. If you are saying ASATO MA SAT GAMAYA (From ignorance lead me to truth...) then prove it. Are you willing to face the real truth or just trying to cling on the illusions for a little bit longer because it feels safe and convenient? Because among very few things I still believe until today is, that the truth will always manifest itself. But watch out, it does not have to be yours. Let's everybody have a fair chance to decide for themselves without any external manipulations. You can sign it, you can stay anonymous and I guarantee that I will not reveal any information about you.

    Here are some links which may be helpfull:
    http://www.swamiji-XXXXX-abuse.com
    http://fakedisciple.blogspot.com/2011/03/who-is-main-person.html

    So what are you waiting for? Speak your mind.

    Roman
  • falseswamijifalseswamiji April 2011
    Posts: 255
    thank you Roman for making this forum
  • %5BDeleted+User%5D[Deleted User] April 2011
    Posts: 0
    Interesting. Where is the discussion?
  • Tony April 2011
    Posts: 172
    I quit the YIDL circus sometime around 1995, after 15 years. I was basically dragged in when I was 13 by my mother, who back then translated for swAmi. She would hang out with him all the time, until she got sick of it and left, also around 1995. My reasons for leaving were I felt that the "philosophy" that swAmi was teaching was just boring, unintelligent, unhelpful, dated, and irrelevant for our world. The yoga exercises were okay, I still like to do that today, but I couldn't care less about some folk songs and tradition from a Rajasthani desert. I lost interest.

    I totally believe that swAmi was sleeping with his students. First, back in those days my mom would simply tell me. She knew stuff, because all the girls would tell her. (Remember, we could not smoke, drink, or eat meat, all that was left for entertainment was gossip.) My understanding then was that the girls were actually into it. And why not? When I first met swAmi, he was still in shape, quite a handsome, exotic-looking, very charismatic guy. And from his point of view, it also makes a lot of sense:

    Have you ever been to a yoga class? You get to see a room full of fit young women, performing all these amazing positions, wearing tight clothes, it's paradise. Every healthy heterosexual man simply has to respond to that kind of environment. You cannot deny the biological legacy of 550 million years of sexual reproduction. This ancient machinery works, and it works reliably, we are here. So now why should swAmi be somehow immune to that? He could have any of the girls there for the price of asking, just like any rock star. How and why would he resist?

    Brainwashing can be powerful. The devotees have no problem believing in his "siddhis", that he can read thoughts, heal by touch, materialize kitchen utensils, know the future, and all sorts of totally absurd imaginary bullshit, but refuse to even consider something perfectly ordinary, something extremely probable, that he, just like any other dude, might appreciate women.

    But indeed, there is a problem. A financial problem. He's made a very lucrative career as an enlightenment salesman (and he is not alone in that business). In that line of work, the claim of being above sex provides extremely impressive credentials. For any healthy human being, to be above sex is just plain impossible, superhuman. So if this orange man is able to renounce that, whatever he's got instead must be, logically, something even more awesome. And that’s exactly what he’s selling.

    Additionally, of course, sex is also ideal to demonize, it’s so impure, so animalistic, everyone feels embarrassed and guilty and inadequate. It’s an old and reliable technique. All religions, sects, cults, and fascists use that, and I just have to quote Frank Zappa: "Every natural human urge has been thwarted in one way or another so that some cocksucker gets to make a dollar off your guilt." But, in order to sustain this business, he has to remain in character, just like Lady Gaga. The show must go on, the mask must be on at all times. Keep it unreal.

    Now, this scandal is bad for his business. Everybody understands they will try to suppress this. Too much money depends on maintaining the fiction. But lets’ be realistic, in any business, there is always some dishonesty and hypocrisy involved. It may be disgusting, perhaps, but it is perfectly human. So, despite the hypocrisy, I have no problem whatsoever with him having sex with his devotees. It’s none of my business.

    However, this completely and fundamentally changes the second when any of the girls is not cool with that. The second when she is actually brainwashed and manipulated into doing things she, deep down, does not want to do. The testimonies on the abuse website are very heavy, very serious. This definitely did not sound like an innocent orgy with an orange-clad, overweight Mick Jagger. They are very disturbing and very unpleasant to read.

    When I was fifteen I was once invited for a "energy sharing" ritual. It’s the middle of the night, you are completely alone with him in a dark room, and he puts his hands all over you and gives you “life force”. It was very creepy and I hated it. After I read the testimonies I got a quite chilling thought: if, in that situation, he had asked me to perform sexual acts on him, would I, at the age of fifteen, been able to get up and run? Would any of the deranged lunatics around, who then included my mother and sister, ever believe me? It did not happen, fortunately for me he was not bisexual, but even so, this disturbing mental imagery has helped me appreciate how completely helpless and desperate these women must have felt. It is extremely, impossibly difficult to break out of brainwashing. swAmi is exceptionally good at it.

    I am afraid, there’s very little how I can help. Perhaps, I am writing this just to demonstrate that it is possible to dump your guru and be perfectly okay. I am not worried about my karma. I don’t believe anymore in karma, miracles, reincarnation, enlightenment, or God, any of that evil and wicked b***s*** invented just to control others.
  • %5BDeleted+User%5D[Deleted User] April 2011
    Posts: 0
    Hello Roman,thank you for opening this site and your statement on the abuse web site.I am one of the woman who had this bad experience with swAmi. I like to come in contact with you. I like to take some actions against him.
  • Roman April 2011
    Posts: 347
    Hello Shakti, thank you for responding and joining this discussion. First of all I admire your courage and strength to come to this point. I can just imagine how difficult it must have been. Send me email to admin@sexabuseyidl.net with your contact info if you want to communicate with me in private. I won't reveal any information about you. As I've said before, I had no doubts that those things happened based on me knowing swAmi for many years. The other side says that there are no facts. Their facts are passages from religious books and folk tales which are based just on leap of faith. That's not enough for me or anybody who is able to really discriminate truth from a lie. I know that somewhere out there are real facts, real living beings who were betrayed and violated. I've seen enough (I have facts in my memory) in other aspects of his behavior. The new sex thing just completes the circle. It all makes sense now and I am sure that more facts will be coming out. Some people told me in private that they knew that he had consensual sex. It is nothing criminal. Sure, but as long as you don't let other innocent and naive come to you under that premise and then you trash them. That is criminal and also totally disgusting. I am looking forward to hearing from you. Roman
  • %5BDeleted+User%5D[Deleted User] April 2011
    Posts: 0
    I have already left swAmi a while ago, because he lied to me, amongst other things. In my own personal experience, I never felt sexual vibrations from him, so the new allegations are a complete shock and I find it very hard to believe.
    One thing I can say with 100% certainty is that SwAmi has an extremely powerful Siddhi: He knew what I was up to and thinking 24/7. He knew past actions, present actions, past thoughts and present thoughts. It has also been confirmed by other very close disciples of his. He choses to reveal it to some, but not others, why, I don't know.
  • Roman April 2011
    Posts: 347
    I've seen him lie and manipulate people many times. I've experienced him asking me about other people's private lives and details that he would not know and then using them back on people many other times. I do not believe in any supernatural powers of anybody anywhere. That's me. I respect your opinion and experience but I respectfully disagree. I myself was many times "reading minds of others". Any good psychologist (even without degree, it's a skill) can do that. Especially if you have an orange robe on you. And if you use spying devices and other means to listen what’s going on outside of your zone you can demonstrate some strong “siddhis”. I’ve witnessed him giving advice to people which ruined their lives. Businesses going broke, marriages falling apart, families disconnected. That’s not just esoteric stuff, it happened in front of my eyes. Could I have done anything about those? I guess, at least those which affected me directly. Maybe even about those which affected others. I don’t know. These sexual abuse things are maybe hard to believe because they’ve just started coming out but they are still coming out regardless of frantic effort to stop it. This is just my personal opinion and I hope you take it that way.
  • falseswamijifalseswamiji April 2011
    Posts: 255
    ok, this discussion blog is now as a link on our web page. let me inform you that our site was hacked but it is online again so it was hacked for a short period of just half a day. keep posting, thanks!

    http://swamiji-maheshwarananda-abuse.com
  • %5BDeleted+User%5D[Deleted User] April 2011
    Posts: 0
    1.) can we have a proper forum, with threads?
    2.) the captcha doesn't work, so I couldn't create a user

    Mostly my participation in forums is with my real name only - keeps me from much stupidity. May I suggest the same for the present participants, especially those who post disparaging comments on SwAmi, and except those women or victims which may have been abused and deserve some protection. Tony, this is directed to you, names and places please.

    BR Ushmeypuri
  • falseswamijifalseswamiji April 2011
    Posts: 255
    names are not so important as long there's no court case. people can express their experiences here without having to be afraid of YIDL extremists knocking on their door, spamming their email account or phone
  • admin April 2011
    Posts: 61
    Hi BR Ushmeypuri, captcha works, make sure that your user name has proper count and kind of characters and you fill out the email info if you want to give out your name. Also check the box to agree to the conditions. I will keep your info private. It's a free country and I appreciate what you are saying but take this forum as it is. Take it or leave it. Tony is the participant's real name by the way. I've created the anonymous sign up option because we are talking about a cult, sexual abuse and other very "touchy" things. I believe that everybody can eventually see through a lie. I know for myself, that what I am writing about happened regardless what others tell me or try to scare me. That was my intention by starting this forum (maybe not proper with threads, I'm too old to go back to school). I've invited the official YIDL side to participate. No problem with that. All I will do is bleep out bad words that we don't harm children's education. That's all. Take care. Roman (admin)
  • Tony April 2011
    Posts: 172
    Ushmeypuri, what exactly is "disparaging" about what I posted? My suggestion that swAmi is just a completely ordinary man, with all human flaws? Do you consider that disparaging?

    I do not know whether he has abused his power and took advantage of his students. The point I was trying to make is that there is nothing crazy about that idea, in fact it is perfectly feasible and believable. Men do that. Priests do that. These things do happen.

  • Roman, thanks for creating a forum, and signing up is ok in Internet Explorer (only).

    Tony, we can agree on that SwAmi is not God, at all, that he is very much human, like all of us. But you got to understand that lots of people, like for example me, have seen lots of good from him. We have seen a funny, loving, energetic guy who introduced us to yoga, which benefitted us greatly, and who created a wonderful sangha of great people and friends.

    So what for example I have seen from SwAmi contrasts with what you and your mother have experienced.

    To close that gap it would be helpful if you could fill in the details of the stories, if you gave date & place for the energy sharing incident, or if you revealed the name of your mother, who apparently heard something of SwAmi's more private life. Maybe you could even convince your mother to participate and to give names and places for girls and incidents, as far as protection privacy permits.

    Ushmeypuri (Vienna, Austria)
  • Durchanand April 2011
    Posts: 74
    Hi Roman and everyone posting here. Maybe some of you know about http://www.esoterikforum.at/forum/showthread.php?p=3173362#post3173362
    (thread: sexueller Missbrauch durch den Guru) there are also a lot of posts in English not only in German. I am trying to post my stuff in both languages. Quite time consuming but somehow necessary.
  • batawebatawe April 2011
    Posts: 409
    in any case, maybe it's time to walk on your own feet, simply live your life the best possible way you can, and express your own individuality but with some sort of awareness, to realize your own projects in life, to protect your own close family and friends and your own creative work which expresses your being and whoever is already inclined to study things their own way, not waiting for the authorities to give explanations and commentaries, than there's no problem; there were authorities and masters and disciples throughout the history in western and eastern world, and western heritage is also much rich to explore, but if you want something canonical to follow or be guided than you can do it, if you want, but to study and come to your own conclusions and live with the insights of your knowledge, I think that would have more sense; that would be a philosophical standpoint and not a believer's one...and no new knowledge or anything came up with just following the traditions and well tested and prescribed precepts; there is no such text or authority that can not be questioned, analysed and re-defined; if you do not dare to critically approach the Shankaracharyan teachings and implications or some other teachings or texts than everything is just maintaining and perpetuating the same approved general formulations and the handing down through the tradition and teachings maybe the same logical fallacies of its originator, especially the notion "All is Maya or this world is maya..." messed things up; and there are philosophical implications behind this that are rooted in some philosophical or spiritual system and nobody asks the question to himself , what does this mean, we just devour things; individuality and critical approach is much needed, but what is the thing that everybody speaks about i.e. Enlightenment or reaching the stages of Samadhi etc., while at the same time the spiritual subjects don't see things in front of their nose but dream about the Enlightenment, which is some far reaching Idea or goal that nobody really understands, that's why you have these days so many gurus and teachers who are propagating some sort of monistic, neo/adwaitin teachings and in many cases they just babble things; well, religion is for the masses and they need moral precepts to follow and spirituality is always individual and to become individual, to be more aware and to grow in your being and expression, you don't need to copy anybody; outer look doesn't change anything, nor orange robe, it can become just power-game and the misinterpreted notion of "now I know and am safe" and the question is also, why are we not satisfied with this mundane things we do and mundane people that we meet and live amongst but want to stick out as the "knowers of the truth" but when you speak about the certain subjects than please do not speculate, do not philosophise etc...bhagavad gita says...this says...let it say than,,,my question is: "what do you have to say?" not gita...I am not speaking to/with you O human, but with your book with which you shield yourself; what do you want to know? Truth?, become the truth?, what is truth, of what are you speaking?, than we can see "they don't know", they just repeat...
  • batawebatawe April 2011
    Posts: 409
    There is an Eastern tale which speaks about a very rich magician who had a great many sheep. But at the same time this magician was very mean. He did not want to hire shepherds, nor did he want to erect a fence about the pasture where his sheep were grazing. The sheep consequently often wandered into the forest, fell into ravines, and so on, and above all they ran away, for they knew that the magician wanted their flesh and skins and this they did not like.

    At last the magician found a remedy. He hypnotized his sheep and suggested to them first of all that they were immortal and that no harm was being done to them when they were skinned, that, on the contrary, it would be very good for them and even pleasant; secondly he suggested that the magician was a good master who loved his flock so much that he was ready to do anything in the world for them; and in the third place he suggested to them that if anything at all were going to happen to them it was not going to happen just then, at any rate not that day, and therefore they had no need to think about it. Further the magician suggested to his sheep that they were not sheep at all; to some of them he suggested that they were lions, to others that they were eagles, to others that they were men, and to others that they were magicians.

    And after this all his cares and worries about the sheep came to an end. They never ran away again but quietly awaited the time when the magician would require their flesh and skins!

    P. D. Ouspensky, In Search of the Miraculous, Fragments of an Unknown Teaching.
  • Tony April 2011
    Posts: 172
    Ushmeypuri, and all, I have no intention to provide any information, any "supporting evidence", and I will definitely keep my poor old mom out of this, because I am not trying to convince anyone, or to prove anything. It seems to me that there is enough damning statements out there already. I have simply shared my feelings, my thoughts, and my personal story.

    I wrote solely to support all others who already know what they know, who have profound doubts but are still reluctant or afraid to make the move. Or for those who have just made the move and are still in the grip of fear. I just wanted to join my voice to all the brave people and say "Hey, don't worry, you are not alone, we did it too, and we are okay. There are many of us. You will be fine. You will be more than just fine. You have survived brainwashing. You have freed yourself. Time to celebrate."

    It is so hard to break out of religious brainwashing, impossible to explain to an outsider.
    First there is plain fear and intimidation. You must obey. You must have no doubts. If you go against the guru, you go against God. You will suffer immensely. The wrath of Mahaprabhuji will be upon you. I actually believed that nonsense. I had never ever seen any miracle, anything even barely outside the laws of physics. And yet I believed that.

    Second, there is, all the time, much guilt for having "negative thoughts". Surrounded by blissful devotees who are all seem to be completely smitten by their orange master, I felt completely alone, inadequate, and guilty about not feeling equally ecstatic. I would think, "Clearly I am the only one here who does not share this bliss, clearly, the problem must lie with me, I am not evolved enough, spiritual enough, sensitive enough, my dark rotten sould is blind to see the beauty of the master. I need to meditate harder." I still remember all this.

    Another feeling, later, after I left, was that of deep shame, embarrassment that I had put up with this crap for so long, that I had failed to trust my intelligence, my reason, I had suppressed all my healthy rational doubts like a stupid trained monkey. Today, this is my secret, I don't want my friends to know that I had once belonged to a religious sect, that for fifteen years, I had lived and behaved like a complete retard.

    So my post was to support all others out there who felt or still feel that way, afraid, guilty, ashamed, or just plain angry, taken advantage of, cheated, to show that they are not alone.

    So, Ushmeypuri, if you feel that swAmi is a "funny, loving, energetic guy", and you think the sangha he created is beneficial to you, that's perfect, enjoy, I am not trying to deconvert you. Clearly, my post was not for you.
  • Durchanand April 2011
    Posts: 74
    THAT WAS SEVA PURI FROM HAMBURGs

    INTRO

    TO HIS STATEMENT FROM YESTERDAY WHICH WENT OUT ALSO TO swamiji@vienna.at - he says that what you read here is maybe only 10-20 % of what he had to find out in the last four weeks:

    Via Mail
    Hamburg, April 19th, 2011

    Dear Hamburg yoga group, dear SwAmi,

    below and also attached find my (first) statement about this so called smear campaign.

    SwAmi, you cannot count on me any more – I am absolutely convinced that you disappointed (not only) my faith in you. What a pity!

    Disappointment – the German word means literally „the end of deception, delusion, deceit“. swAmi is the great beguiler, one girl disciple taught me right in the beginning of my time with YidL - now I understand what she wanted to say. „You all do not know and understand who is sitting in front of you.“ you said from time to time – now I know what you meant with that. Is an enlightened master in need to mention in a webcast (3rd of April 11) that everybody who thinks or speaks badly about him will get all his bad karma? With this you only want to produce fear in the watchers! I have no fear of bad karmas because I do not do any bad deeds when trying to turn my view towards the truth. I can understand, accept and forgive many things – but I cannot accept that somebody abuses his power under the cover of an enlightened master only to have his pleasure.

    You say: „One cannot leave his/her Master.“ and „It is your own fault if you jump out of the boat.“ – I say I cannot leave a master because I never had one. And now I do jump out of your boat because i realize that it can not bring me to that destination I want to reach. So easy.

    Why don´t you just admit what you have done? It would make everything much easier. But you are to deeply involved in it...

    Anyway I will never forget that I learnt many good things through your inspiration. And I am thankful for that. But the view on the good things shall never put a veil on the shadow sides – an enlightened master and a true swami is a role model and does not hurt the most important yogic principles like ahimsa, satya, brahmacharya, asteya and aparigraha.

    I bid you farewell – Satyameva Jayate

    Hari AUM

    seva puri from Hamburg
  • Durchanand April 2011
    Posts: 74
    AND THAT IS THE STATEMENT:


    Hamburg, 19th of April 2011

    Hari AUM all brothers and sisters

    Dear members of the fellowship of YIDL Hamburg,

    Seva Puri is writing to you in short (he could give you many more informations and details).

    This statement is my personal declaration about the present allegations against SwAmi and not an official statement of the Hamburg fellowship.

    Hereby I resign as a member of the Hamburg board committee, I dismiss my membership and I do not teach for YIDL anymore.

    WHY? As some but not all of you do know already there is a website against SwAmi (better: for truth) on the internet which the International Fellowship of YidL calls a smear campaign.

    Please google: „SwAmi Abuse Missbrauch“

    Or look there:

    http://www.swamiji-maheshwarananda-abuse.com/

    http://www.esoterikforum.at/forum/showthread.php?t=149397&page=32

    For three weeks I was absolutely convinced that this is really a smear campaign and there is absolutely nothing to those allegations of sexual abuse. I was sure that one cannot keep such a story for 29 years under the carpet. Impossible! Why 29 years? In the statement of S. Milicevic (Sw. Chidanand) we could read that he heard in 1982 the first time about such an allegation. Also I was in YidL for nearly 7 years, spent altogether 8 months in Strilky summer seminars, India and I was on more than 30 weekend seminars with Swamiiji. I also was working in the committee for nearly 5 years and had n e v e r heard about a single rumour. I have erred.

    In the last three weeks this has changed and in the meantime I have (together with 15 others of the Hamburg group members) very strong doubts when SwAmi says very vaguely that there ist nothing behind these allegations.

    In Australia SwAmi has even sworn this a few weeks ago. Still this could not keep the Australian organizers after they had done their own investigations from taking nearly all informations about SwAmi off the Australian YidL website.

    The three main ashrams in Sydney, Dungog and Brisbane and also the ashram of Perth have canceled the invitations for SwAmis Australian tour 2011 even in the year of the 20th anniversary of YidL Australia! The big tour takes place but in a completely different way than originally planned. This is something that none of the formerly extremely devoted organizers would ever do out of a spontaneous mood.

    I am absolutely convinced in the meantime that the majority of the allegations is correct and I am also convinced that we will see many more true allegations. Completely independent of all the reports from the Internet, from Serbia, from Slovenia, from Australia I (and others) I came to the conclusion that we have to take the allegations of the victims serious and that we have to do more investigations.

    The reason for that is a part of the secret and suppressed history of the Hamburg ashram. Something I did not know anything about three weeks ago.

    We have a credible testimony of an absolutely trustworthy former woman disciple of SwAmi who told me and others of our group verbally, in written and personally about a sexual relationship with SwAmi in the years between 1991 and 1993.

    She was not the only one of those „special“ disciples in Hamburg and also in Vienna there were (are?) some. But she does not want to give the names of those others involved to protect their personality rights. The main point about that is to give those reports from other countries enough attention that such a big deception or dilusion through the master could really take place.

    Some of SwAmis Hamburg disciples had been informed about these sexual relationships between disciples and SwAmi in about 1995. They did not want to believe that, they forgot and suppressed those informations (for 16 years!). But today some of them remember. Now that this kind of things seem not to be single cases. Partially they started to remember very exactly what they had been told.

    All testimonies of the aforementioned former woman disciple connect so intensly with the memories of the other Hamburg disciples and also with the allegations being made on the abuse website that the accusations get very much densified.
    For me personally it is enough that there has been even one sexual contact to know that there is no enlightenment and no control of the senses. For me with that SwAmi clearly leaves the field of a holy master who can liberate his devotees.

    BUT TAKE NOTICE: this witness gives emphasis to the fact that not one of her experiences was made against her will and that she did not feel being misused! Even though if one looks at that now this was some kind of a bad misuse of her devotion as a disciple.

    As this woman disciple was on a distance to the group in the last many years she did not get the word of that so called smear campaign against SwAmi. The more convincing it was when she being asked the first time by one member of the Hamburg group if she had sex with SwAmi gave a report using the same words SwAmi seems to have used with most other girls too to break their last doubts like given on the abuse website: „...What will you give me? Will you r e a l l y give me everything?“ etc. All the procedures, the words, sentences and the method which she reported from her experiences correspond to those that are being reported on the abuse website.

    That is not an evidence yet. But that strongly indicates, that we have to do further research if you want to avoid that others will say that you wanted to sweep something under the carpet. Unfortunately the majority of the comittee did not want any more research on the topic.

    During the board comittee meeting on Sunday, April the 3rd 2011 I got no room for this topic. The majority of the comittee did not want that anybody would act as an investigator or as someone to whom members could speak out. Also they did not want an extraordinary members meeting for further information and clearing. I had emphasized that it would be good to get legal counsel. This was also not seen as necessary. Why not?

    If one has nothing to hide one could await such a research completely relaxed, couldn´t one? Such an ignoring of facts should not be allowed to occur in a fellowship with open minded members.

    Please draw your own conclusions. We are not talking about criminal law. For many of the allegations there would be a limitation of actions concerning the allegations against Swamiiji. What we need to do is to open our hearts for the victims and to examine if the chosen master is still worthy of our worship and adoration. The main point about this is to think for yourself and to think freely.

    With love

    Seva Puri

    who could not escape his intuition, his heart and the use of that thing that God has given him between the ears.

    I will continue practising yoga every day and do my sadhana. Also you can do seva in many places and satsang also is not only offered by YidL.

    Nothing is lost. But something has added – clarity and freedom.

    I write to you all of this for your information. You can mail back if you feel like it – but try to write like a yogi. If you have questions I will try to answer them. Or maybe you want to help the truth to come into the light of day.

    If you do not want to get any more mails then just tell me.
  • %5BDeleted+User%5D[Deleted User] April 2011
    Posts: 0
    Hallo,
    the swAmi abuse web page is hecked again. They work hard on preventing news to appear on the net. Besides Seva Puri's statement there is 5th testimonie on the way, that is the most shocking of all.

    After all we can say only this - be aware of ANY GURUS that want you to give them EVERYTHING, REALLY EVERYTHING.
  • Durchanand April 2011
    Posts: 74
    Does anyone know if they hacked esoterikforum.at also? Looks like it at the moment...
  • batawebatawe April 2011
    Posts: 409
  • Durchanand April 2011
    Posts: 74
    thanx - seems to have been a problem with my laptop.
  • %5BDeleted+User%5D[Deleted User] April 2011
    Posts: 0
    A very strange thing happened two days ago: I tried to re-activate my "falseguru" website about swAmi, but in the process found that a strange e-mail address appeared under my "recovery e-mail" address. When I say strange, I mean it was strange, because I didn't put it there! It was the e-mail address of the Webmaster of the Sexual Abuse Site against SwAmi!
    I'm not a nerd or genius on the Internet, and I have NO idea how that could happen. Sent an e-mail to Google, have received no reply, but they activated my google account again, and allowed me to register the "falseguru" website again. So now I have it back, and I'll let it sit. I deleted all of the old content, and only wrote a small page as an explanation. (With funny cartoon, I love cartoons)
    http://sites.google.com/site/falseguru

    Elisabeth, Sydney, Australia
  • In the meantime I for one have received independent confirmation, from a real life source as opposed to internet sources, that swAmi has always had an interesting and varied sex life. One question remaining is to what degree engagement on the part of the women was voluntary or sometimes perhaps less than voluntary. The dilemma of even a well practiced seducer, he cannot know if the woman plays reluctant to add to the excitement or if she lacks willingness. Maybe, in time, a court will want to decide.

    Personally, I am sorry for Yidl and wonder if it will be possible to salvage parts of it from the train wreck, after proper truth finding and reconciliation. All will depend on if swAmi will come out with the truth or if he will remain stuck in his current posture, blustering and threatening as if nothing has ever happened. To my mind, the least he will have to do is disrobing.

    The most important thing must be to reassure those women who have come out with their stories that they are neither schizophrenic nor guilty of anything, and that the persecution they have endured from enraged "followers" will fall squarely back on the persecutors themselves.
  • %5BDeleted+User%5D[Deleted User] April 2011
    Posts: 0
    to: falseswamiji
    Can you post the Bosnian statement in doc format instead of docx? Thank you.
  • Roman April 2011
    Posts: 347
    Ushmeypuri, I am glad that you keep your mind open and are using that thing God gave you between your ears as Sevapuri has so eloquently put. I know what has changed your mind. You talked to somebody you trusted and it was reliable source. I can say at least for myself that my participation in the internet discussion is based on the same thing. Since this has come out I spoke to some of the abused victims. There was no hidden agenda, jealousy or whatever crap they attribute to them in their talking. There was just lot of sadness and pain but also strength and determination to wake up from many years of nightmare, pick up pieces and go on with their lives. If somebody is talking about smear campaign they should look directly in mirror. A person who is very close to me asked me: “Why do you care? You will never know for sure and so what? Why don’t you just let it run its course?” My response is: “I can’t. I couldn’t live with myself. Could you?”
  • batawebatawe April 2011
    Posts: 409
    I was thinking about all this happenings and asking myself what is the main problem regarding the sexual acts etc...acts as such are of course non-questionable in normal situations where there is voluntary consent involved and there is no rule to prohibit that...but the main thing that is problematic is within which context does the sexual act manifests; sexuality has always been a slippery terrain and according to certain traditions it was definitely regulated and the whole sexuality things gets this ideological connotation "of what is proper sexuality and what is not" etc...

    I was browsing through "Karma and rebirth in classical indian traditions" by Wendy Doniger O'Flaherty and there I found some stanzas said in different texts (Manu texts), par example: "...to the faith of the unfaithful wife: she is disgraced in this world, after death she is reborn as a jackal, tormented by diseases as punishment for her sins...faithful wife who controls her thoughts, speech and body...such a wife besides gaining renown in this world, obtains in the next world a place near her husband....this sequence which forms a mini-system of its own, clearly illustrates the nature of Dharmasastra rules on rebirth....the stress in this case is definitely on the need for wives to be faithful to their husbands...hence the opposition: unfaithful wife -> jackal ; faithful wife -> the world of (her) husband

    The question whether the husband himself has lived the best of lives, and, therefore, whether he himself will move on to the best of worlds, is totally irrelevant. A similar stanza in Yajnavalkya (1.87) indicates the true meaning of Manu's "world of the husband"; it holds out, for the faithful wife, ."

    In this context I was contemplating, how the patrilineal elements were important in hindu tradition and the question of women in hindu tradition and their role and reagrding their sexuality...and how the sexuality and asceticism co-exist or can be excluding or mutually existing...and I think you already read somewhere or heard that ancient rishis had their wives...and there are also stories connected with that and their jealousy etc...they were at the same time forest dwellers, ascetics and the householders and the role of their wives was important,,,if the wife made some mistake or she could become unfaithful etc. they could loose all their power...
    ::::::::::::check this pdf. excerpt (The Wives of the Rishis) by Lynn Benett, Dangerous Wives and Sacred Sisters: Social and symbolic Roles of High-Caste Women in Nepal
    http://www.thlib.org/static/reprints/kailash/kailash_04_02_04.pdf

    here are some stuff you can find in the text itself:

    *ambivalence towards women in patrilineal ideology its association woth sexuality which
    is also an unending source of contradiction in Hindu tradition

    *concepts of purity and pollution betrays a strong underlying respect for the values of asceticism

    *things associated with pollution are associated in some way with birth, death, copulation, eating or defecation=organic processess of life
    and temptations of the flesh which tie men to the samsaric cycle of birth and death=ascetic attempts to escape, these very same things
    through his austerity/tapas and renunciation/tyag

    *ideals of asceticism=>women and sexuality are dangerous distraction

    *hinduism: ascetic/householder contradiction (sapta rishi, embodient of that contradiction; gotra founders, they represent the continuity of patriline)

    *rishis are ascetic forest dwellers but they are also householders because they have wives;
    it is the wives of the rishis with their distracting sexuality, their own unsated sexual demands and
    eventual unfaithfulness who delude the rishis and hinder them in their spiritual pursuits

    *ascetic tradition based on misogyny (quick to challenge the chastity of any woman and is therefore suspicious of the wife of the forest dweller)

    *menstrual blood as a strong source of pollution

    *a woman becomes polluted for the first three days of every mensus, she may not carry water, cook food, worship gods, touch adult men,,,

    *the myth of pollute menstrual blood is in the Rishi Panchami Vrata Katha

    *menstrual blood is symbolic of affinal women - women in their specifical roles of wife and mother

    *sexual love is considered the keenest pleasure known to the senses. But it is felt to be destructive to a man's physial and spiritual well being.
    Woman are powerful, demanding, seductive and ultimately destructive.

    ________________

    well, all this shows that things are much complex in relation to the practices, rules, tradition that is passed down or distorted and todays rituals, rules etc...and specifically the role of the women, which is a demanding and dangerous subject! (for men! - always has been;)
    http://in.ygoy.com/2010/07/30/rishi-panchami-2010-%E2%80%93-dates-and-observations/

    I'll paraphrase Lacan's words: "For a soul to find its being (truth), from it, they differentiate - the woman."

    ...would like to emphasize only the fact "that all the problems surge up in this collision of two structures" - namely, the ascetic/brahmacharya principles and householder/regulated sex principles...and if we follow the ascetic traditions in all the various religions, than women are definitely subjects that must be 'excluded' or avoided, even if the ascetic structure incorporated the women-ascetics into its 'program', but they are having their own communities or places...so, if you are an ascetic, than one thing is sure: no sex here, please!____so, the whole problem is not that you are having sex, but who is having it and why and here we come to the social structure, in this case a monk orders, which on their own field do not allow sexual activities for various psychological and spiritual reasons etc...

    ...and many times the influences of this ascetic principles and orders and prohibitions many times become unclear, and if you ask, why this and why that, they all quote some passage and seal the thing quickly...or someone may think, he would like to become monk, ascetic or a swami and through certain period of time realizes he didn't nor is able to transcend his sex impulse or craving to be with other person and here we see again the collision of those ascetic principles, as if they are eternal per se, and the ones who chose to be with other person can from a 'spiritual' standpoint look inferior....and here we have a power-trip of the ones that accept the renunciation, that can hide many problems and many self-imaginations about ones new-born persona, which in many cases doesn't work at all...

    I was just thinking today also,,,that phenomenon of in India, who drink their urine, eat feces and defile everything that is sacred to the puritan hindu, still with the attempt to reach the spiritual truth beyond the differences and oppositions of pure and impure; they look to me as a necessary consequence of the hindu puritan mind, they are it's hidden truth, embodied in aghori's character; the feces, the fear, the 'dirt', stands in front of them in the form of aghori-ascetic, they see their own "Sh..t" manifested.

    so, for the aghori, a recless tantric of some sort etc, which works as a symptom of the puritan mind, there is no problem with menstrual blood with this or that,,,but with puritanic background and rules of the male-dominant-ideology, there are many rules and many NO's and if you do not obey and go against, your position in afterlife will not be good...so you ask yourself: what is all this?, is this just some sort of control and if it is, it doesn't work...

    to conclude: you can directly or indirectly make your own conclusions to what I posted or shared here, just some random topics which can trigger some thoughts on this subject...maybe all this traditions with their push to transform the sexuality into future godliness backfire sooner or later...

  • Roman April 2011
    Posts: 347
    You give a thought to just one thing: It was all written by men. I rest my case.
  • %5BDeleted+User%5D[Deleted User] April 2011
    Posts: 0
    http://www.welt.de/politik/deutschland/article12473696/Sexueller-Missbrauch-soll-nicht-mehr-verjaehren.html
    Found this link just now, a court case, in Germany, dated February 2011, a man was awarded 7500 Euros, for a sexual crime committed against him 20 years ago. So maybe the girls CAN go the legal way?
    Also found this petition about getting rid of the time limit in relation to sexual abuse:
    http://netzwerkb.org/petition/
This discussion has been closed.
← All Discussions

Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!

Sign In Apply for Membership

In this Discussion

Devotees' testimonies:

Devotee #1

---------------

Devotee #2

---------------

Devotee #3

---------------

Devotee #4 - Contact: valika.balazova@centrum.cz

---------------

Devotee #5 - Contact: synapseproblem@yahoo.de

---------------

Devotee #6

---------------

Devotee #7

SiteLock